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Maptalk-Digest Saturday, December 19 1998 Volume 98 : Number 498

Re: A link to your site?
    From: Jim Rosenfield <>
Fwd: LTE: Don't knock it till you've tried it.
    From: Mark Greer <>
Re: MAP: Maptalk List issues
    From: "Tom VonDeck" <>
    From: "Tom Hawkins" <>
Here And There In Europe
    From: Pat Dolan <>
Sent LTE: Illegal Plant Grown For Medicine, Man Claims
    From: R Givens <>
LTE: Hasn't helped teens
ART: Express-News news release relating to Philip True


Subj: Re: A link to your site?
From: Jim Rosenfield <>
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1998 07:18:37 -0800

Think for Yourself will be pleased to honor your request to link.

Let me further mention a few sites that fit your criteria:

At 07:01 AM 12/18/98 -0800, you wrote:
>Like the information you've made available, so thanks.
>If we hear no objection from you, Citizen Review will probably link to your
>site from its Recommended Reading web page (estimated for web publication by
>the end of the year). 
>The link will be grouped with links to other sites that expose malefeasance.
>Citizen Review is truly non-partisan (since there's truly not much
>difference, it's impossible to be partisan actually) and its links will
>reflect this.
>Additionally, when time permits (no promises on that event), we'll look at
>your web design information and perhaps add it to our other links on the
>subject (
>Once again, thanks for your efforts to expose yet another arena
>demonstrating the society's endemic "confused on the concept" problems.
>Best regards,
>Roberta Caravelli
>Citizen Review
>"that government . . . for the people 
>shall not perish from this earth" (A. Lincoln).
Jim Rosenfield                      
tel:  310-836-0926                  fax:  310-836-0592


Subj: Fwd: LTE: Don't knock it till you've tried it.
From: Mark Greer <>
Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1998 15:25:19 -0800

> mapinc set sender to 
> using -f
>X-Originating-IP: []
>From: "stuart kocher" <>
>Subject: LTE: Don't knock it till you've tried it.
>Date: Thu, 17 Dec 1998 14:31:57 PST
>Dear Editor,
>In response to Al Ronnfeldt's letter (12-15-98) and in defense of Jerry 
>Epstein of the Drug Policy Forum of Texas I would offer the following 
>advise to your paper and Mr. Ronnfeldt; Get an education.
>A.R's attempt to "explain"  the legalization argument does nothing more 
>than attest to his ignorance of the subject. It also shows how a 
>mainstream publication like the Express can be used by the shallow to 
>perpetuate the same worn out "non-sequitor" of the Drug Warrior 
>It is ludicrous to proffer inanities like "Despite millions of dollars 
>spent on police, theft has not been eliminated. So should we legalize 
>stealing? How about murder?" as arguments to the debate of Illicit drugs 
>and the effectiveness of our failed SIXTY year old policies.
>Mr Ronnfeldt purports to believe that if the billions we spend on the 
>war on drugs saves one life that is a price worth paying. Is it then 
>also his contention that the growing numbers of innocent persons shot to 
>death in their homes as a result of botched police raids are also a 
>miniscule price to pay to save that one individual? Should we then 
>deduce that your journal would support Mr. Ronnfeldts contentions?
>His simplistic view of  the drug laws and the reform movement are 
>archaic, shallow and dangerous. They are also, unfortunately, the norm 
>in this nation. Sadly his mentality and the hard party line of our 
>nations top drug warriors will be responsible for the deaths of more 
>children in Plano, Texas and elsewhere simply because they won't take 
>the time to do some reading. 
>I would like to challenge Mr. Ronnfeldt, your journalists and those 
>readers at home to contact this organization of concerned citizens and 
>seek the government documents that support Mr Epstein's position. I am 
>sure he, myself and others in the movement would be more than happy to 
>supply him with the thousands of documents we each had to study to come 
>to the decisions we have regarding our laws and the harms they are 
>inflicting on our children and society. They can be reached by sending 
>an e-mail to  Attn:DPF Board or by phone at (972) 
>stuart kocher
>403 E First St.
>Arlington, TX  76010
>(972) 650-8905
>>Get Your Private, Free Email at

Mark Greer
Executive Director


Subj: Re: MAP: Maptalk List issues
From: "Tom VonDeck" <>
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1998 09:00:04 PST

Sorry about that.  I do agree with the NRA on gun control for the most 
part.  I posted it because I heard a rumor that the National org was 
fighting for tougher drug laws not too long ago.    Can't verify it, 
though.  It's a vague memory.   You're right that the issues are very 

>I recently received a snail-mail from NORML, and in it they list the
>"Top Ten Bad Guys of Marijuana Prohibition" or something like that. One
>of the entries mentioned that the person "carries water for the NRA". I
>know no offence was intended as I am sure none was intended in the
>posting of an NRA alert accompanied by the statement "And no I'm not a
>member.  Don't worry".
>I am.
>It seems that people assume that if you are anti-prohibition then you
>must be anti-gun, but to me that would be philosophically inconsistent.
>To my way of thinking, you cannot take the U.S. Consitution a-la-carte.
>If you wish to have the protection of the first, fourth, fifth, and
>sixth amendments, you must respect the rights of those to whom the
>second amendment is dear. Likewise, if you hold the second amendment to
>be the most important (the argument is that it protects the others), 
>must respect the rest, even when you disagree on how those rights are
>being exercised.
>If we must, let's agree to disagree. I do not wish to get involved in a
>debate on this matter, let's just keep in mind that there are 
>people on this list that will disagree on non-drug-prohibition topics
>like gun control, abortion, public school vouchers, and for some of us
>these other issues are just as important as ending drug prohibition. 
>Mark McNamara
>A member of the NRA, NORML, the SCCA, and the Libertarian Party of

Get Your Private, Free Email at


Subj: NORML & the NRA
From: "Tom Hawkins" <>
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1998 11:44:30 -0800

Hi All,

I have not seen the snail-mail from NORML but am a NORML supporter as well
as a member of the NRA.

Interestingly enough, I became a member of NRA because that is an issue near
and dear to my father. By exploring each other's issues and seeing how they
effect one another we came to a better understanding of each other's causes.
My father now supports my efforts and I his.

I imagine no offense was truly intended by NORML in this matter.

Keep fighting peacefully,

Tom Hawkins


Subj: Here And There In Europe
From: Pat Dolan <>
Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1998 17:33:57 -0800

(The following courtesy of Newshawk "Harald Lerch" <>;
and translator Pat Dolan. First something light, followed by a more serious
item which might give many of us needed food for reflection over the
holidays. File it for a pensive moment. pd)
Wash Cycle ‘Normal’ for Hashish

Regensburg (Germany) - According to a report in the Passauer Neue Presse
( 12/16/98, a Regensburg drug dealer’s idiocy lost him
his ‘stuff’. He hid 800 grams of hashish in the apartment block washing
machine. An unsuspecting resident used the hiding place for its original
purpose, selecting the ‘Normal’ wash cycle for his clothing (and the
‘stuff’!). The police are now looking for the dealer.

Source:  Die Presse (Austria)
Copyright: Die Presse 1998
Pubdate: Fri, 17 Dec 1998
Author: Martub Stuhlpfarrer


Conflict avoidance

Parents learn to better understand their offspring in communications
seminars; how to solve problems with difficult children, and how to survive

Vienna  -  "So much can be spoiled bringing up children. And when they are
18, we are presented with the bill. I don’t want to experience that with my
child." Those were the words of Edouard Pinkhart, who attended a
communications seminar held recently in Vienna for parents, teachers and
social workers.

Maria Neuberger agrees. As Director of the Workshop for Parents, she is
familiar with this situation. For the last two years she has headed the
team of counselors for life and living.   Under the motto: "Education is
(not) a game for children," she offers seminars and provides a
communication tool for parents, grandparents and teachers, 

Many parents mistakenly believe they understand their children. When
problems arise, they are often too proud to admit it to themselves.’ 

Of the parents who attend the seminars, Neuberger says, "These people bring
the necessary preconditions with them. Others, who desperately need them,
lack the courage to attend."

Participants are invited to relax and consider their own childhood. They
are asked to be openly self-critical, and ready to face unpleasant facts.
"Those who are prepared to work on their own education, avoid passing these
mistakes on to their children," explained Neuberger.

Parents are brought face to face with problems of teen-age drug use,
aggressive school-ground conduct, disobedience, hostility, and  all kinds
of behavioral problems in different phases of development, with which they
feel themselves unable to cope. The right recipe for dealing with difficult
children sounds quite simple: listen to them, take them seriously, be
tolerant, but never compromise your own authority. "One must hand over
responsibility to them step by step. Then they will learn independence and

A special seminar will be held to help parents deal with Christmas. Many
find the intimate atmosphere of family gatherings unpleasant and need to
learn how to cope with these inner conflicts.  

Copyright "Die Presse" Vienna


Subj: Sent LTE: Illegal Plant Grown For Medicine, Man Claims
From: R Givens <>
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1998 06:05:22 -0800 (PST)

Feebleminded is the best description for our khat ban. Racist is another? The
khat law was passed specifically to target Somalis and East Africans
in the United States for criminal punishment for continuing a harmless cultural

Ignorant is another good word for US khat policy, because the
effects of khat are not much different than the effects of the coffee
beans which so many millions of American citizens are addicted to.

Careful analysis of the World Health Organization (WHO) report, "Chewing
Khat," reveals that khat produces the same daily use patterns found in
caffeine users and an honest appraisal indicates that khat use is far
less dangerous than coffee.

WHO tries to depict khat use on a par with amphetamine addiction, but
the studies admit "medical problems (associated with khat) are
infrequent." Certainly less common than with coffee, which causes well
over 20,000 deaths annually in the U.S. and Canada because of
coffee-induced ulcers, strokes and heart attacks. Coffee is also
implicated in cancer and fetal injury.

Most of the problems WHO blames on khat are more a reflection of
social conditions in East Africa (i.e. millions starving in Sudan)
than the effects of any drug.

Banning khat is typical of lunatic US drug prohibition policies that
waste billions in valuable resources trying to suppress substances
that cause less trouble than it takes to enforce the laws against them.
Jailing people for khat use is on a par with jailing coffee users because
of their caffeine habit.
Redford Givens
contact info

Pubdate: Fri, 18 Dec 1998
Source: Houston Chronicle (TX)
Copyright: 1998 Houston Chronicle


SAN JOSE, Calif. (AP) -- The first person in this country arrested for
growing a rare and exotic East African stimulant claimed on Thursday that he
was cultivating the plant for medicinal purposes.

Musa Ahmed Gelan, 40, of Prunedale, Calif., pleaded innocent in U.S.
District Court to manufacturing a controlled substance known as khat,
pronounced "cot." His lawyer, Donald Foley, said Gelan was growing khat to
help control his diabetes.

"He had no idea anything was illegal about this," Foley said. "The plants
are part of his ethnic background."

If convicted, Gelan could face up to 20 years in prison.

The leafy, reddish khat is popular with people in Ethiopia, Somalia and
Tanzania, and the Middle Eastern country of Yemen, Gelan's homeland. When
chewed, users say it produces a mild euphoria.

Khat is illegal in the United States because it contains an amphetamine-like
substance in the same category as heroin.

Gelan was arrested in September when federal and state authorities raided
his quarter-acre field and seized more than 1,000 plants. Drug enforcement
officials said it was the first outdoor khat plantation discovered in the

- ---
Checked-by: Don Beck


Subj: LTE: Hasn't helped teens
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1998 08:44:21 -0600 (CST)

Too bad this person has such a generic name. There's quite a few
in the phone book that match. Wanna do a mass mailing to them?

This is a mighty fine letter.

From the 12-19-98 Dallas Morning News

- -----------------------------
Hasn't helped teens

Re: "Swiss sense -- Country's rejection of drug legalization
gives hope," Editorials, Dec 2.

I was rather surprised by the tone of your editorial concerning
the legalization of drugs in Switzerland. You seemed to thing it 
was funny that any enlightened society would consider the 
decriminaliation of any controlled substance. Perhaps the Swiss
should follow the United States' example of throwing everyone
in jail who is caught with a minimum amount of these drugs.
Making it illegal to possess these certainly hasn't helped
the teenagers in Plano be any safer.

M.C. Smith,


Subj: ART: Express-News news release relating to Philip True
Date: Sat, 19 Dec 1998 12:07:27 -0600 (CST)

I'm sure many of you have heard about the suspected murder
of San Antonio Express-News reporter, Philip True.

From the 12-18-98 San Antonio Express-News

- ------------------------------------------------
Express-News news release relating to Philip True 


Dec. 18, 1998 

This statement is made on behalf of the San Antonio Express-News and all 
of its journalists and employees, and Marta True, the widow of Philip 
True, from her home in Mexico City. We hope it will serve as an accurate 
expression of our feelings about the current investigation. We also want 
to dispel media reports based more on speculation rather than fact or 

First, we wish to express our profound gratitude to all the different 
authorities and individuals in Mexico whose timely actions enabled us to 
find and recover the remains of Philip True from his makeshift grave in 
a remote mountain canyon in the state of Jalisco. 

Our first debt of gratitude is to all the Huichol Indians who 
participated in a ground search of the rugged sierra where Philip was 
last seen hiking, which led to the first reliable report of his 

We never would have found Philip, or discovered that he was a victim of 
a homicide and not a hiking accident, without the concerted search 
efforts ordered by President Zedillo and key officials in his 

The Mexican Army from the Fifth Military Zone in Guadalajara, as well as 
the state governments of Jalisco and Nayarit, responded swiftly with 
on-the-scenes search efforts. 

Officials at the U.S. embassy in Mexico City and consular offices in 
Guadalajara also took extraordinary measures to assist us at all times 
and considerably eased the logistical challenges through this shocking 

Although it especially painful for Marta to endure additional medical 
procedures to the remains, we welcome a second autopsy ordered by 
President Zedillo and scheduled for Saturday, 9 a.m. in Mexico City. We 
appreciate the gesture by the PGR to invite the Federal Bureau of 
Investigation to observe the procedure, and we believe a second report 
will eliminate any doubts, if they exist, that Philip was the victim of 
a homicide and not an accident. 

Reports that Philip was in the Sierra Madre Occidental to investigate 
drug trafficking or cultivation are false. He was combining a hiking 
vacation with a long-held desire to produce a report on the Huichol 
culture, which he admired and wanted to explore as a journalist. There 
is no evidence to suggest he was the victim of foul play by drug 
traffickers or cultivators. 

Any speculation about motive behind his murder would have to include 
robbery, or the possibility he somehow offended area ranchers or other 
residents suspicious of outsiders, or opposed to the presence of a 
foreign journalist. At this point, unless authorities have developed 
leads, the motive remains unknown and the killer or killers 

What is known is that much of the personal property Philip was carrying 
at the time of his death remains unaccounted for, despite a thorough 
search of the surrounding area where his body was first dropped and 
around the site of his makeshift grave. The missing property includes a 
new Canon camera and lenses, approximately 4,000 pesos, his wallet, his 
passport and all personal identification, his boots, an array of camping 
gear and outdoor wear, and the backpack he used to carry it. 

The Express-News is paying a 10,000-peso reward to the Huichol Indian 
who first located Philip's body on Monday, before unknown persons 
subsequently buried it for undetermined reasons, and who enabled 
authorities to locate the grave and recover the remains of Philip True 
on Wednesday morning. 

A second reward of 10,000 pesos will be paid to the person or persons 
who provide authorities with reliable information leading to the 
identification and arrest of the person or persons responsible for the 

Robert Rivard
San Antonio Express-News

Friday, December 18, 1998


End of Maptalk-Digest V98 #498

Mark Greer ()         ___ ___     _ _  _ _
Media Awareness Project              /' _ ` _ `\ /'_`)('_`\
P. O. Box 651                        | ( ) ( ) |( (_| || (_) )
Porterville, CA 93258                (_) (_) (_) \__,_)| ,__/
(800) 266-5759                                         | |
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